India v England -Day 4

p1070637Unless something very, very odd happens tomorrow, this test match is destined to be filed under “bore draw” along with Nagpur 2012 and Trent Bridge 2014; the last two tests to go the full distance between these two teams. That it doesn’t quite feel like that is because of the debacle in Dhaka. We would, according to the scribes and the pundits, have bitten your hands off for this result. England’s batting looking stronger than it has in the last few seasons. England’s spinners outbowling the Indian spin attack we were supposed to be terrified of. It has been a very good England performance on a surface that has not deteriorated noticeably over the first four days.

Yet again I have a confession to make. I saw the last hours play only. Blame Australia. Watching their collapse in Hobart last night was car crash TV. They not only capitulated to some excellent seam bowling, there was a comedy run out (which prompted the debutant’s brother to storm out in disgust) and Steve Smith assaulting Vernon Philander. Add to that Michael Clarke appearing to be under the apprehension that Philander being off the field meant the visitors had to field with 10 men (the sub fielder I think executed the run out) and Mark Taylor admonishing Paf du Plessis for running towards the umpire on an LBW shout (while sitting next to his co-commentator, that ultimate respecter of umpires, Shane Warne) and I couldn’t take my eyes off it. This meant bed time at 2 am, and waking up late. So sorry, I hope you enjoyed more of the play than I did.

Of course, we are seeing that age old English media trait of appointing someone as the saviour on the basis of first evidence. Take it away Scyld:

and if that wasn’t enough:

Now let me say this before you tear into me. I’m thrilled he looks the part, and he does. But he’s playing on a placid surface, against bowlers neutered by the pitch and in a 500 plays 500 test, more or less. What he has shown his temperament and class. Of course he has, but because he’s 19 we’re touting him as some child prodigy. “Touched by genius” in my view is a bit strong. Let’s see a big ton in the 1st innings of a match, or a pressure-filled hundred on a bunsen before we go the whole hog. This is a hugely impressive debut, but it’s not Trott at The Oval in 2009, it’s not KP at Lord’s (coming in at 20/3, soon to be 20/5) and it’s note even Cook at Nagpur in 2006 which was in the balance when he made it. This test was there to be made safe and Hameed has. There’s plenty to get excited about before we make Hall of Fame plans. Scyld can be a bit of an outlier, and in this case, I think the heat might have got to him.

He’s not alone, though. Plenty will follow, marvelling at the talent and temperament of a mere 19 year old. I’m sure I saw someone suggest he make our T20 team (because he hit a six). I’m here to be the grump. Let him play five/ten tests, playing on surfaces more testing than this, to see if he truly is the messiah, or merely a young talented boy.

Adil Rashid. Luxury bowler. Discuss media. Discuss.

The match appears headed for a draw. England’s 114 for 0 put them 163 in front, and a brisk pre-lunch session may tempt the visitors to try to set up a three to three and a half hour exercise in survival. England have worked very hard and will not give the hosts a sniff, so a lead of 270-280 with 45 overs left may be something like a target to go for. There is a school of thought that we should bat out time and let the hosts fry. I hope not, but also strongly believe a big marker has been laid down here by England. We aren’t going to be outmatched so horrendously that 5-0 was on the cards. It’s not the time to gamble, and we have a captain who won’t. If we are back here tomorrow talking about anything other than a routine draw, we are in for a hell of a day.

Some Statto Tweets for reference:


Which includes Mark Ealham and Ed Smith…..

Comments below….


39 thoughts on “India v England -Day 4

  1. Rooto Nov 12, 2016 / 7:18 pm

    …and David Capel. Ye Gods!
    Agreed about the likelihood of a result. We’ll be moaning about Cook’s conservatism this time tomorrow, but without any real gusto. We wouldn’t expect milk from a chicken…


    • LordCanisLupus Nov 12, 2016 / 10:15 pm

      Newman went into hyperbole overdrive on HH. So a look back to the past is worthwhile.

      Newman on Robson after his ton at Headingley (after a lot of moaning about his Aussie heritage).

      Well, if Miller had looked into Robson’s eyes he would have seen a fiercely determined, old-fashioned opening batsman who is likely to be a prolific, if not always entertaining, member of this England team for years to come.
      To be at Headingley was to almost step back in time to the days when Geoff Boycott would have the locals in thrall to his accumulative methods and a scoring rate of just under three runs an over would be positively giddy.
      Robson is a friend and contemporary of David Warner but he could hardly be more different, both as a man and a batsman. His steady, unspectacular style and under-stated manner are almost an antidote to the excesses of the modern game.

      Not the same for Lyth. Other things took precedence.


  2. Mark Nov 12, 2016 / 8:29 pm

    Yes, I was watching some of the Australian stuff last night. Comedy gold. It’s made even funnier by the channel 9 one eyed brigade. I think Mark Taylor said something like “it was almost a good shot” that saw the demise of Warner. This was a horrible slash in the first couple of overs.

    As for England they managed to avoid the nightmare today of India batting all day and getting a 100 lead to have ENGLAND needing to bat well past tea tomorrow to save the game. Only one team can win now and it ain’t India. You never quite know in these 3.5 hour bat to save the game jobs. If it starts to turn big who knows? But odds on the draw.

    Delighted for Hameed, but as you say it’s early days. Why he wasn’t opening in Bangladesh I don’t knoww. The selectors picked him in the squad so it was down to the brain trust of captain and coach. Jut a reminder that Newman was more concerned about Butler not being picked than Hameed. Rashid also showed what he can do if the captain has 500 to defend. Even Captain Cook can give him a go.


  3. Julie Nov 12, 2016 / 9:01 pm

    Am in Hobart watching AUS v SA.Was amazing watching OZ bat or perhaps “get out”just like when we were in Edgbastion 2013. Maybe hubby and I are jinxes.It’s raining this morning so who knows how much play there will be today.( raincape out)Would you believe no umbrellas allowed.Have only been able to watch England on Criinfo on my tablet which is better than nothing.No Fox tv in our hotel.5th day is going to be interesting but can’t see Cookie making anything like a brave declaration. Draw coming up!!!That wicket was unbelievable.


  4. SimonH Nov 12, 2016 / 10:44 pm

    West Indies won a Test so obviously one piece of good news has to be followed by another round of fighting between the board and the players;


    • d'Arthez Nov 13, 2016 / 1:04 pm

      Yup. Of course, the last thing anyone in the West Indies want is a competent WICB. After all, no other soap opera is written freely.

      I am not sure what Darren Bravo tweeted (I saw a tweet reported on on Cricinfo, but there might be more on it). If he tweeted that Dave Cameron was a moron, that was offensive. But not to Dave Cameron.


  5. SimonH Nov 12, 2016 / 11:38 pm

    Rain preventing any comedy from Australian cricket on the pitch so how about:


  6. quebecer Nov 13, 2016 / 2:27 am

    “It’s not the time to gamble, and we have a captain who won’t.”

    True, and True. Except… I’ve been thinking about this.I was doing the maths in my head and thought we’d want maybe 60 over to bowl them out, but that meant a probable target of 250 odd, which was far to in the realms of possibility, no matter if in reality unlikely. It’s 1st test, so you don’t do it, no need. Except… Look we’ve got some raging turners to come. We’re going to have far more difficult tests than this, yet here we are in THIS game getting to make the decisions. I then wondered, how many other games are we going to have that luxury? That was the thought that struck me.

    Getting all strategic, this might be one of the best opportunities we have to do this in the series and that needs to be considered when weighing up the gamble in terms of risk and reward. We’re not going to be able to compete so well on the bunsens to come, after all, so do we not need to take full advantage of this now? And in the end, if it doesn’t come off, losing 3-0 or 4-0, does it matter? And what if it does work and we go one up? How big is that?

    Not sure I’d do it, mind you. But I’m just saying that there is a strategic/risk assessment argument to be made. But I wouldn’t do it. What a chicken shit. Still.


  7. Clivejw Nov 13, 2016 / 4:35 am

    Well, to that I would say that sometimes the hype is on the mark, as it was with Cook and Root. And I think that this will be another time. I’ve never seen a 19-year-old with such excellent technique as Hameed. He uses the depth of the crease and plays the ball late. You can see why they’re calling him Baby Boycott. Unless he turns out to have a weakness to the short ball on a fast track… To hell with it, I’m going to make a rash prediction and say he will be playing for England for the next 15-20 years. But Giles Clarke is unlikely to gush about his being from the right sort of family. (Actually, his family are lovely).


  8. Clivejw Nov 13, 2016 / 6:02 am

    So he was eventually out for 82 to what was damn near being a no-ball… I still think that he is the long-term replacement for Cook.


  9. Clivejw Nov 13, 2016 / 6:22 am

    Lots of people on Twitter who should know better gloating about Cook now having more test hundreds than Bradman. Yes, in 135 tests as opposed to 52.

    Wish they wouldn’t do that. I was quite prepared to congratulate Cook on a fine innings today (after his scratchy play yesterday evening) and on being the first to score five centuries in India. There is no doubt that he is a fine player on these pitches.

    Liked by 1 person

    • LordCanisLupus Nov 13, 2016 / 9:17 am

      I note one in particular who thinks it generates traffic to now have a go at the people who don’t sign up to the love fest. Sad.

      I watched Adelaide 2010 last night. Cook and KP putting the Aussies to the sword. Great times. No rancour. No bitterness. No schism. Just loving it.


  10. Rooto Nov 13, 2016 / 6:34 am

    Interesting conversation on TMS at lunch. Dobell says he’s quite sure Flower pushed for Hameed’s inclusion.
    He and Agnew agreeing that there’s been a change in the team culture since (unspoken) the Flower days, which is now allowing the Hameed family (who paid for themselves) to hang around the team hotel and ‘be there’ for Haseeb. Etheridge wasn’t really having it, but it came across as very defensive for the old order


    • pktroll (@pktroll) Nov 13, 2016 / 8:43 am

      Not even close to being generous. On the forum I frequent more than here, I suggested that 280-290 from around 55 was about right. Instead we had 310 from 49.

      As I write Rashid has got Pujara with a ball that pitched outside leg that he didn’t review! Even so, with a drop by Broad off Ansari earlier that would have got Vijay I think it is perhaps a bit too late to make it a real chance for England to get all ten. It was always an optimistic effort but even more so with less overs too play with and chances being missed.


      • quebecer Nov 13, 2016 / 11:20 pm

        Yeah, watch it. If you post on other places Dmitri starts fucking with your avatar.


  11. Escort Nov 13, 2016 / 7:22 am

    Simon Mann has just described Cooks declaration as generous. Is it?


    • BoredInAustria Nov 13, 2016 / 7:37 am

      310 in 49 overs

      Cricinfo: 62.6 Cook gets to his 30th Test hundred. Another superlative knock from the captain. His dominance in India continues.

      And, as it is crazy times and things happen I have never expected, I suddenly have a new conspiracy theory regarding the surprisingly placid pitch we have seen, and the outstanding expenses ….

      I will take my coat..


  12. fred Nov 13, 2016 / 8:28 am

    This is a blog about English cricket, no need to be paying any attention to an Aus/SA fixture happening on the other side of the world. Entirely inappropriate discussion.


  13. BoredInAustria Nov 13, 2016 / 9:21 am


  14. d'Arthez Nov 13, 2016 / 10:18 am

    England grab four wickets. A bit of luck with the umpiring (Pujara). Just 11 overs left as I write.

    Just 49 overs to get the 10 wickets is too little time on this wicket. Target was always going to be nominal with required run rates above a run a ball, and no Dhawan in the Indian lineup (who is the only stroke maker in the top 3).

    I have said it before, and I’ll keep saying it again, but England is lucky that Gambhir is playing. He is a worse player than he was 7 years ago. Why Indian selectors keep persisting with the tried and failed is beyond me.


    • pktroll (@pktroll) Nov 13, 2016 / 10:23 am

      Nearly every Indian fan that I have come across either on twitter and on other cricket sites, sees Gambhir as a player in a similar manner as England fans see Gary Ballance. I understand that KL Rahul, who had been injured for a couple of games has been scoring runs in the Ranji Trophy so he’ll be back for the next test.


  15. pktroll (@pktroll) Nov 13, 2016 / 11:04 am

    Miller is going on with his ludicrous fanboy idiocy with regards to Cook saying how anyone criticising him for declaring to late has not been watching the game. It really could have been at least 6 or so more overs and then there would have been an opportunity. I do think some of the criticism of some of the relatively slow scoring in the morning is a little unfair. It isn’t that easy to score runs quickly on that pitch on a 5th day, but less than 60 overs to score 28 would have been a reasonable declaration. Instead I do think it was a fair bit too cautious and has allowed India a bit more leeway.


    • LordCanisLupus Nov 13, 2016 / 11:11 am

      There’s a good part of me that thinks he saw the reaction to his FirstPost article on Cook and thought there’s clickbait mileage in that. The danger is you need to truly believe what you write. I know what gets clicks on here – KP, Cook, England losses – but you have to be honest, otherwise people see through you. Only Peter can answer that for himself.


    • d'Arthez Nov 13, 2016 / 11:15 am

      Rule of thumb: look at the opposition top 3. With Vijay, Gambhir and Pujara they’d never go and chase such a target at 6+ / over. There are more stroke makers down the order, but when you get them in, wicket preservation takes precedence. If it had been Dhawan instead of Gambhir, India might have gone for it – for exactly as long as Dhawan would have been in.

      The target was nominal, unless England had decided to bowl like a bunch of drunken sailors. Which obviously they would not be doing.

      280 from about 55 sounds about right PKTroll, and I fully agree with you there. Also notice that England suddenly decided to bowl at 16+ overs / hour, in the final session, when they could not be bothered to bowl 14 / hour on Day 3. Those overs they have thrown away would have been useful too.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Ian Nov 13, 2016 / 11:27 am

        People pointing out India regularly chase 300 in ODI’s. Well there is the clue in ODI’s.


      • Mark Nov 13, 2016 / 12:00 pm

        Great point about the over rate. The cynicism of Cooks approach shown through.


    • "IronBalls" McGinty Nov 13, 2016 / 11:19 am

      I said on another thread that England had cheated themselves not getting tbeir overs in…now, who knows, it may have turned out different?

      Liked by 1 person

  16. d'Arthez Nov 13, 2016 / 11:07 am

    Draw. Jadeja stuck around, and hit a few boundaries to eat away some time. Rashid took 3 wickets in this innings. He might merit a 4/10 in the MSM.

    Liked by 2 people

    • SimonH Nov 13, 2016 / 11:33 am

      Match figures of the spinners:

      Rashid 7/175
      Ansari 3/118
      Ali 3/132
      Jadeja 3/133
      Mishra 3/158
      Ashwin 3/230

      Number of Tweets during the match praising or even commenting on any aspects of Rashid’s play by Selvey, Newman and Stocks: 0.

      (That’s excluding Stocks’ Tweeted link to his article that appears to be about Rashid but is really about the coaches. The combined Tweets by those three about Cook and Hameed during the match totals about 20).

      Liked by 1 person

      • nonoxcol Nov 13, 2016 / 11:50 am

        “The performance of Rashid must not be allowed to overshadow that of Cook.”

        Pretty much a direct quote from (Selvey) one year ago in the UAE. Fat chance when he’d already dismissed Shoaib Malik’s double in the same match inside a paragraph, while spending an entire article writing about Cook’s… and then wrote about it again when the game was over.


      • Mark Nov 13, 2016 / 11:53 am

        Which only goes to show why they are all nothing but lackeys and brown nosing Cook peasants. Thankfully their numbers are being thinned out in the media as the owners of these publications lose more money because no one wants to read their drivel.

        The MSM is full of people who get it wrong all the time. Britain won’t vote for BREXIT, Trump won’t win the election, and Cook is a great captain. No womder less and less people want to pay for this idiocy. You might as well invite drunks off the street to give there opinions, they couldn’t be any worse.

        Liked by 1 person

  17. Ian Nov 13, 2016 / 11:09 am

    280 off 55 perhaps might have been better but not sure that would have been enough as Kohli and Jadeja looked comfortable enough at the end. Dropped catches and the overs lost on other days may have had more of an effect.

    Liked by 1 person

  18. Mark Nov 13, 2016 / 11:41 am

    So the Cook fan boys in the discredited media are out in force. Proclaiming another Cook hundred, and a near miss of snatching an unlikely win. No doubt a 9/10 or even a 10/10 score awaits.

    Well, I say complete bollocks. If ever you want an example of why England need another captain this was it. Starting the day 163 ahead with 10 wickets in hand what was required was for England to get on with it. If they had been 3 down over night you could well understand the caution. But they weren’t. If they had lost 2/3 quick wickets they could have shut up shop and taken a couple of hours out of the game. But they didn’t even try. Instead Cook batted for himself. A slow 2 runs an over job. A selfish effort from a selfish captain. It just confirms my belief that the entire Cook captaincy is about his own milestones. His own self agandishmemt. The national team is just a vehicle for “I Claudius Cook” to gorge himself on meangingless records. And the idiot media who cheer on this fraud should be laughed at. What’s left of them as so many have been sacked or retired off.

    His only tactic is to wait for the opposition to self destruct. Amazingly this obvious plan has sometimes worked. You would think international captains would spot it for miles away but still they fall for it. Cooks great fielding position today was to have squad members positioned behind the boundary to throw the ball back. As usual, when the opposition can not possibly win Cook becomes attacking.

    Some will say the only winner here was the pitch, and a result was never likely. Probably true, but Cook didn’t even try. And that is the biggest crime of all. The modern test captain is completey devoid of any imagination. The notion of risk is non existent. Offering something to get something is a foreign concept. Apparently some moron claimed this was a generous declaration. He probably needs to get another job. One where he knows what he is talking about. I will now retire and wait for the usual Cook luvies to claim otherwise. Good luck. You will need every ounce of intellect to defend this shameful, shellfish Cook performance.

    Liked by 1 person

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