England v New Zealand – 2nd ODI

OK, got that Pringle stuff off my chest. Now on to the cricket.

We were all gobsmacked at that batting performance on Tuesday, and now the importance of this game is paramount. Can we follow that style up? What if we need to chase a big total? How will that go? Can the relative rookies take a grip of the game and show their talent?

Again, sadly, I’m in the office so won’t get to see a lot of the match. I also know Vian isn’t going to be in contact with the game but we’ll do our best to cover the action and bring you our reactions.

Irrelevant as they may be.

Comments below, as usual.

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72 thoughts on “England v New Zealand – 2nd ODI

    • wrongunatlongon Jun 12, 2015 / 10:22 am

      cheers for the link; i generally can’t abide this BreatheSport thing as it just seems a way of getting me to click another link needlessly, but i’ll probably watch this tonight, given it’s a video..still wouldn’t mind seeing a KP vs Cork version, or something like that…

      Like

  1. metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 8:19 am

    The weather is likely more conducive to a lower scoring game, and Southee will be back.
    However, win or lose, I’ll be happy if England keep attacking with the bat, because we have to get to a place where we always believe the “par” score is more than the laptop score.

    Like

  2. Sherwick Jun 12, 2015 / 8:30 am

    There can’t seriously have been a laptop score, right? Surely that was a joke?

    Like

    • thebogfather Jun 12, 2015 / 10:26 am

      Those BBC B Micro figures worked well until 1994 apparently…sadly their computing speed meant all calcs took until 2014 to decipher, so were 20 years out of date by then, by which time the TCCB stock that had passed to ECB had no available upgrades, and, not being aware of on-line tweaks that weren’t compatible either.
      I believe the ECB then borrowed a Commodore64 from one of the MSM, pre-loaded with GrahamGoochCricket, which they then used as a tactical base, despite crashing of cassettes after 30 mins of loading, to plan ahead.
      Mr Pringle, upon losing his safe seat MSM, then requested its return.
      The ECB, cleverly, had already thought ahead and accepted a number of used but new laptops from their american agent, one Mr Stanford, who had used such items to enhance his global monetary ponzitivity, an idyll that Sir Giles thoroughly recommended.
      Sadly, the union between ECB and Stanford was curtailed by those pesky FBI/USA peeps, and the ECB soldiered on…
      The final few relics of the now forgotten ( copyright MSM) Stanford episode were distributed to TheDarkLord and his muppet MooresThePity…

      Like

  3. Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 10:09 am

    I don’t really care if they can’t follow it up. 400 is not something you do everyday. I’m just enjoying The Cook/Broad free England.

    Nice to see Morgan get some runs as well in the last match. He didn’t have a good World Cup. But funny how the ECB Pravda media demanded his sacking unlike their constant excuses for 2 years of Cook failure.

    Something else we were right about, but hey hoy……..the MSM is where being wrong constantly is rewarded.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. PepperSydney Jun 12, 2015 / 10:23 am

    I am hoping that NZ just had a bad day , and that today’s match ( I understand this is a day match, which is handy for my time location ) will see NZ revert to their ENG smacking ways… ah well….. luckily I will be able to console myself with some good cricket continuing in the WI, should my hopes be dashed re ENG v NZ..

    Like

    • volkerelle Jun 12, 2015 / 11:04 am

      It also contains a neat little “inside”-and-by-implication-outside reference. Makes a nice change for the Guardian.

      Like

  5. PepperSydney Jun 12, 2015 / 10:25 am

    I think it is a fair comment to say, that anyone who watched ENG play Bangla Desh, which I did, and then see ENG v NZ the other day would have to ask the horrible question, if they were horses, would you be sending for the stewards?? Such a huge gap in performance………

    Liked by 1 person

  6. Silk Jun 12, 2015 / 10:36 am

    I think the NZ performance demonstrates something that I’d been saying for a good six months (and for which westcorkthinktank took me to task for saying) — that Moores, far from being the outstanding coach of his generation was actually a drag on the players. It wasn’t merely that he failed to get the best out of them, but that he actively dragged them down.

    He didn’t do it on purpose of course. It was just that everything he did in his coaching of England made them worse. More tentative. More uncertain. More worried.

    I said England would have been better off with zero coach (rather than Moores) and told to just go and play their game. I was mocked.

    I was, of course, right.

    Like

    • Benny Jun 12, 2015 / 10:57 am

      Makes sense to me and now Dravid is saying that India don’t need a head coach. “‘The Wall’ said on Cricinfo: “There is no need for basic coaching at that level. You are looking for someone as the guiding factor or someone to create a good environment which helps to grow and share some of the experiences that we have.”

      Like

  7. Sherwick Jun 12, 2015 / 10:58 am

    Well said Silk.
    I never understood why KP had to resign back in 2009 for saying that he wanted Moores out?

    Like

    • Silk Jun 12, 2015 / 2:06 pm

      KP had to resign because a faction within the ECB wanted him out, had always hated him, and leaked the “back me or sack me” request which he’d made in private to the ECB.

      Even the ECB itself later admitted that stuff was leaked and shouldn’t have been. Plus de change ….

      Like

    • Zephirine Jun 12, 2015 / 11:20 am

      and the England dressing-room even more viperish. What a bunch of trustworthy young chaps they were, to be sure.

      Liked by 1 person

      • BoerInAustria Jun 12, 2015 / 2:21 pm

        .. including the trustworthy Clint Strauss who got a nice job promotion and salary increase at the end of this

        Like

    • metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 3:54 pm

      Worth noting of course that Bose does some rewriting of history. In particular he misses out the bit where the ECB leaked KP’s views (solicited in confidence) on Moores…

      Like

  8. Boz Jun 12, 2015 / 11:12 am

    Whilst spending too long this morning in a carpet shop, deciding on carpets for the home, I was inclined to wonder why, as the T20 Blast is the latest signicure of the ECB, why is there an international match in London (again, of course) whilst Friday night is ‘BLAST’ nite!! Now, do I have some justification for this position or is it as a direct result of my carpet shop experience?

    Liked by 1 person

    • escort Jun 12, 2015 / 6:19 pm

      Both i would think. The same thing happens in Australia doesn’t it?

      Like

  9. amit Jun 12, 2015 / 12:29 pm

    if anyone needed proof that Jordan’s bowling is not quite international class yet, just watch him bowl today.

    Like

  10. wrongunatlongon Jun 12, 2015 / 12:34 pm

    I wasn’t convinced by Finn in the last game. Got a few wickets when the openers charged him, it happens. Still went for a few, and wasn’t bowling at his quickest. “HE’S BACK”…hmm. Not sure.

    Like

  11. PepperSydney Jun 12, 2015 / 12:56 pm

    it was nice to see that NZ followed my advice , upon winning the toss , they decided to bat…… and their run rate is a nice 7.5ish kind of thing…..

    Like

  12. PepperSydney Jun 12, 2015 / 1:28 pm

    Three lovely cricket things to see over the last day or so.. Kane Williamson batting , Steven Smith batting and Jerome Taylor bowling…… it is like a fiesta of gorgeousness.

    Like

  13. BoerInAustria Jun 12, 2015 / 2:26 pm

    Does TMS know somethings?
    “During the interval (around 430)…”

    Like

  14. amit Jun 12, 2015 / 3:01 pm

    How does Jordan get to bowl filth over after over and match after match?

    Like

    • metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:21 pm

      Said it last time and elsewhere – not sure why we’re picking Jordan over trying out Willey – we should be finding out about players – esp. since Willey would bring some variety (LH bowler).

      Like

  15. thelegglance Jun 12, 2015 / 3:09 pm

    To build either the anticipation or the dread, I’ve just finished nearly 3,000 words on the press. Hmmm.

    You’ll have to wait. Or hide. One or the other.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 3:29 pm

      I can’t wait to read it. They deserve everything you’ve got. Or rather a certain cabal of ECB boot lickers do.

      No doubt they will demand your national security number, employer, school your children go to, and blood type.

      I don’t know why The Guardian doesn’t shut down Selveys BTL comments section. Why pretend you want to hear other people’s views, and then remove everyone who doesn’t swear allegiance to how great 3 wicket Mike is? There is no point to it.

      Like

    • Tuffers86 Jun 12, 2015 / 3:31 pm

      As you might be aware long reads are the in thing.

      This will be fun.

      Like

    • thebogfather Jun 12, 2015 / 3:35 pm

      I hope you’re paying for your own carrier pigeon to send it by…

      Like

  16. amit Jun 12, 2015 / 3:13 pm

    so 7 sixes off Jordan so far. how many does he want to give away?

    Like

  17. Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 3:44 pm

    381/5 after 48.2 overs.

    This is fantastic news because England will have to bat under huge scoreboard pressure. Which is what is needed for England to improve over the next 2/3 years. We must not get boged down in the the hear and now. We need to experience these situations and enjoy them. Become less frightened of them.

    Like

    • Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 3:51 pm

      398/5 after 50 overs.

      Should be interesting stuff.

      Like

      • Rooto Jun 12, 2015 / 4:10 pm

        Agreed. This is where all the talk of ‘new attitudes’ is tested. I hope they’re up to it. I personally would rather 180a.o. after 35 overs than 305-6 after 50.

        Like

        • LordCanisLupus Jun 12, 2015 / 4:12 pm

          This probably won’t be chased and really shouldn’t be. I’d like to see us chase 340 or so though because that might be the new normal.

          Like

      • Rooto Jun 12, 2015 / 4:12 pm

        Sorry. Think my maths is out. Those RRs are similar! Hope you see my point, though.

        Like

      • thelegglance Jun 12, 2015 / 5:19 pm

        I doubt England will get anywhere near. But I’m more interested in seeing them have a good crack at it. Chasing down 400 doesn’t exactly happen often.

        Like

    • metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:12 pm

      To be fair, Kabir Ali and Saj Mahmood both bowled enough overs at a worse rate to be considered as more expensive, in my view…

      Like

    • Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 4:13 pm

      Good!

      I know it seems bizarre but I want England to bat against big scores. We need to realise that 250/275 is not going to cut it anymore. 300 is minimum in good batting conditions.

      Iam not bothered by the result. We need to have a sea change in the way we play.

      Liked by 1 person

    • metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:19 pm

      However, I find picking Jordan over Willey in this series particularly strange. Surely we’ve seen enough of Jordan to know that he’s still developing. We’d do better to find out something about Willey, particularly since he’s a left-hander so would provide some variety…

      Like

      • Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 4:22 pm

        How much do you want to bet they played him for his fielding?

        Like

      • metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:42 pm

        @Mark – are you trying to get me to burst a blood vessel?
        F!ng England and playing players for their side-benefits – drive me nuts…

        Like

    • Rooto Jun 12, 2015 / 6:43 pm

      On that first page of 50 entries, 3 are Dernbach, 4 are Harmison (included for comparison purposes), 7 are Broad and 10 are Anderson. Not necessarily important, but …

      Like

      • LordCanisLupus Jun 12, 2015 / 6:44 pm

        Raining around 8 miles from the ground going north west. Won’t be long.

        Like

  18. Sherwick Jun 12, 2015 / 4:14 pm

    The first one that is not in the past 10 years is someone called ‘DR Pringle’ back in 1987 …

    Like

  19. Sherwick Jun 12, 2015 / 4:18 pm

    Interesting that in the match that Mahmood has the most expensive econ rate of 11.4 in back in 2006, Plunkett bowled in that match too!!!

    Like

  20. Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 4:25 pm

    If we can get a batting unit than can score 300-330 on a consistent basis, and we can then get a bowling attack that can limit sides to 350 maximum, we are well on our way to winning more matches than we loose.

    Like

    • metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:48 pm

      I’d agree that is where we need to be. If you have good bowling conditions you should aim to do better on the bowling side, but the balance of limited overs definitely goes to teams who can regularly bat big.

      Like

  21. metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:44 pm

    Admire Roy & Hales trying out positive strokes – but at some level it’s a little worrying that they can’t even connect well enough to get an edge and get out…

    Like

    • metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:50 pm

      Well, that reverse-jinx worked well… šŸ˜‰

      Like

  22. metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 4:47 pm

    Surprise, surprise – it’s Matt Prior in the commentary box…

    Like

    • Mark Jun 12, 2015 / 4:55 pm

      They look after their own.

      Cook may be a bit of a challenge though. “Er, um, ur um” is not going to cut it in the commentators box. Probably find him a job working for Strauss.

      Like

    • thelegglance Jun 12, 2015 / 5:21 pm

      For some reason, they’ve never invited Kevin Pietersen in there. Odd really.

      Like

      • "IronBalls" McGinty Jun 12, 2015 / 5:26 pm

        At least he got a gig on tms!

        Like

    • escort Jun 12, 2015 / 6:24 pm

      How cheesy is that!!!

      Like

  23. Rooto Jun 12, 2015 / 6:45 pm

    Not unhappy with how things are looking (a respectable defeat unless Rashid and Billings go postal now). This could be par for this team, and it seems like vast progress.

    Like

    • LordCanisLupus Jun 12, 2015 / 6:47 pm

      Agree. They’ve had a good go and until Buttler got out looked like a live opportunity.

      Like

      • Rooto Jun 12, 2015 / 6:56 pm

        Yes. Am not often able to watch, but have got it on the computer at the mo’. Frankly disappointed at the commentators’ views. Prior saying “these two have got to try and build a new partnership now” meaning “platform”, and now Bumble: “they’re still going for it. Perhaps need a bit more care…”
        Err, not when it’s 10 an over. You chuffing well go for it. These guys get it. The commentators are behind the times, but I shouldn’t be surprised by that.

        Like

  24. SimonH Jun 12, 2015 / 6:52 pm

    Australia all out for 399 in Jamaica. Two outstanding individual performances (both career bests):
    1) Steve Smith 199. Third Australian out for 199 in Tests (the other two were both in the 1990s and one etched on English memories). It’s Smith’s second dismissal in the 190s – they’ve found his weakness! Is he the new Vaughan? Smith was in for the fourth ball of the innings and no-one else made fifty. He is setting all sorts of batting stats – one is that he is fifth fastest Aussie to 9 Test centuries (behind Bradman, Morris, Harvey and Hussey).
    2) Jerome Taylor 25-10-47-6. He has an incredible record at Sabina Park – only Walsh, Hall and Marshall have taken more wickets at the ground. The other bowlers took 4/340.

    Now to see how the pitch looks when Australia bowl on it……

    Like

    • Rooto Jun 12, 2015 / 6:58 pm

      And Smith’s dismissal looked entirely dependant on the lack of snicko. That home boards should have to pay for these things is ridiculous. Perhaps when the big 3 suffer a bit more in this way, things will change.

      Like

    • Pontiac Jun 12, 2015 / 7:31 pm

      Nathan Lyon is on fire.

      Like

      • northernlight71 Jun 12, 2015 / 7:58 pm

        Poor bloke. Somebody throw a bucket of water his way.

        Like

      • Pontiac Jun 12, 2015 / 8:04 pm

        Well, according to the rule they take him off after a 2 wicket spell and he probably won’t get the ball again until tomorrow or something.

        Like

  25. Rooto Jun 12, 2015 / 7:24 pm

    One more thought. They’re just coming off for the rain with England behind the D/L. However, I’m more impressed by this performance than the first match. Pressure on and the batsmen responded. (Also it’s interesting how McCullum’s tactic of front-loading his good bowlers on a day with a dodgy forecast could well have paid off handsomely)

    Like

  26. northernlight71 Jun 12, 2015 / 8:03 pm

    Have to finish at 9.15, apparently. No way they could stay out any longer. You know, those floodlights cost money to run. And the locals need their sleep.
    Pfft, cricket sometimes really doesn’t help itself sometimes does it?

    Like

  27. metatone Jun 12, 2015 / 9:20 pm

    I missed the England batting, but it seems like they had a good crack at it.
    Well done – although I’d still like to see Willey get a bowl in the next game.

    Like

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